This past Wednesday, the United States Mint unveiled images of the upcoming 2024 230th Anniversary Flowing Hair Gold Coin, giving collectors a first look ahead of its Nov. 14 release. Initial details included the coin’s description, specifications, and a limited mintage of 17,500 pieces, as shared in an earlier CoinNews article. Unlike its silver medal counterpart, which included a "230" privy mark on select examples, no privy mark option was initially mentioned for the gold coin.
However, on Thursday, the U.S. Mint issued a news release, found here, officially introducing the gold coin and adding a key update: 230 of these coins will indeed feature a "230" privy mark and will be exclusively offered through a special auction. The Mint specified:
"As a tribute to the number of years that have elapsed since the Flowing Hair dollar coin was introduced, the Mint will also auction 230 one ounce, high relief, 24-karat gold coins with a "230" privy mark on December 12, 2024. The first coin will be auctioned with the die in a custom-made display box. Each of the coins will be accompanied by a certificate of authenticity hand-signed by the Honorable Ventris C. Gibson, Director of the United States Mint. Additional details about this special auction will be released at a later date."
Both the gold coin and the previously released silver medal honor the 230th anniversary of the first dollar coin issued by the U.S. federal government. Each shares the iconic 1794 dollar design by Robert Scot.
The silver medal, released on Oct. 15 — the 230th anniversary of the original dollar’s issuance on Oct. 15, 1794 — proved popular, lasting for just over 24 hours before becoming unavailable. The Mint indicated that 1,794 of these medals featured a special "230" privy mark, which were randomly distributed to buyers upon purchase. Numerous examples have since commanded exceptional prices in the secondary market.
Further information about the gold coin is available on the Mint’s dedicated page to the piece.
This should be interesting.
Rooster,
Another master of understatement steps to the fore.
Once again, only available to the select few (dealers).
Antonio,
And due to the much higher stakes involved in this particular case, what with an FH gold coin instead of an FH silver medal in play and only 230 privy marks to be had among the FH gold coins as opposed to the 1794 privy marks the were available among the FH silver medals, the “select few” will likely become a “considerably more select far fewer” for this latter round.
Dealers to the ultra rich maybe. Pretty sure none of my LCS friends have that client list.
Christo,
Humanity marches on but history tells us that things don’t really change all that much along the way. We’ve transitioned from emperors to billionaires but behind the trappings it’s all still pretty much the same.
Indeed.., the interesting is just getting started…. See last post,
I have no doubt that the “Gold FH with the Privy Mark” will end up in the “100 Greatest US Modern Coins.”
I agree E1, and only 230 pcs….
It looks like it’s going to be even more gorgeous when the in hand & TPG photographs come out…
Yup, it’s a whale of a coin.
Cheers
I’m just hoping we don’t have to be bidding against billionaires for any of these 230 pieces. After this week’s election results and stock market reaction, there’s a lot more of them out there. One things for sure…it will be interesting.
Craig,
I don’t know if you’ll be bidding against billionaires but I do believe you will be going mano a mano with the millionaire coin collectors.
No doubt. Think about it. How many coins have mintages of 230 that aren’t errors? The WWII privy was 1,939. This will be MUCH rarer. There may be more Charlotte & Dahlonega Mint coins available out there in each year and denomination than 230. Yeah, millionaires will be involved. I wouldn’t be surprised if the minimum bids on every one of the 230 are 50 to 75k.
I’m not saying you are wrong on what the minimum bids will be, just saying let’s wait and see as the mint releases further information. I could see spending 50k for one, but if they end up 75k or above, then I’ll let others enjoy them. I have to say this is a great way to end a basically boring year of coin collecting from the mint. I say that because I haven’t bought anything from them yet.
Agreed. It will certainly get attention for the Mint. I’ll probably try for one if I can get into the auction. My collection is precious metals proof coins. I suppose if I fail my collection will become publicly available precious metals proof coins.
REB,
Regardless if you’re lucky enough to get one, you will still have a collection of Au coins that few (very few) people can imagine. All I can say is it must be a delight to peruse your vast collection! Well done.
Thanks. I do enjoy it in the minutes that I’m not working to support it.
Hmmm, $50k a coin?
Antonio,
I have to laugh now when I think about the fact that we were all talking about how the Mint has to drop its prices. Instead the Mint is going price-wise where no Mint has ever gone before…straight up and apparently not even the sky’s the limit.
Craig,
While I agree that the election results and stock market performance may indeed have helped further enrich some already bulging coffers, it’s also true that the wealthy do quite well in both good times or in bad, makes no difference to them. Discretionary money is their middle name.
Discretionary spending would make a privy mark FH proof gold dollar quite a nice addition to their portfolio or collection. The sky’s the limit when they put it up for auction.
E 1,
Whether or not the 2024 FHG with Privy will ever join the aforementioned elite club it will take its place among the most expensive Mint coins right out of the gate.
Wait until they’re up for auction years from now. A coin only to be dreamed of owning.
Antonio,
The one thing future buyers will have going for them as far as possible price moderation is that the population of these coins will likely remain fairly constant as they will doubtless be slabbed from the get go. In the old days coins such as these went each way and everywhere without being protected from the effects of aging and handling and as such both the numbers and the condition of them deteriorated enough so that the few stellar examples remaining tended to astronomically increase in value.
Not saying they’ll be worthless, but look on in 10 or 20 years I don’t care how rare it is, it never was, and never will be, dollar denominated and therefore a product solely for the rubes that almost certainly will drop precipitously in value relative to the highs the auction sees. Congress can’t or won’t pass interesting legislation for the mint to really be able to put their imagination and creativity into projects and this is what we get. New Morgan dollars. New Peace Dollars. A flowing hair dollar we can’t even call technically call a dollar! Whoopiee! Maybe… Read more »
It’s absolutely a US one dollar coin. The denomination is in raised lettering around the edge.
FHG Pricing (based off of previous weekly London Fix average, Thurs thru Weds) –
AM / PM Fix
11/7 – $2,667.05 / $2,692.0
11/8 – /
11/11 – /
11/12 – /
11/13 – /
11/14 – Game Day
Running average = $2,679.53
Grid range (Avg to-date): $2,650 – $2,699.99
Forecasted Price: $3,690*
*based off of weekly running average
Turned out to be $3,640. Sold out in less than five minutes.
Hmmmmm.., let’s see, (thinking).., $75,000 for FHG Privy with COA #1, or a full tank of Av gas for my Gulfstream 700.., decisions decisions…. LoL
Keep Calm & Stack On,
Or, $75,000 for FHG Privy with COA #1 or a well-funded retirement account? As always each to his own and for myself that means security over speculation any day.
This spring at the ANA show as I walked past her table, I congratulated Ventris on how the release of the L&B was handled. Her answer to me?
“Just wait until this Fall, just wait”
I guess this is what she was talking about..
It’s a brilliant Mint money grab imo. That #1 coin and die could sell for 6 figures no problem…
It’s too bad the regular Joe FHG collectors won’t get a shot at a Privy, bummer…
Rick come on it’s a stretch but you and Ventris like peas in a pod…. Good for a 12% discount…….we will be lucky to get into website
I called her out for selling more L&B’s after 30 days, no more peas!
No discount but maybe she’ll scratch an Extra “V” on the edge for me!?
We’ll get in for the coin no problem, but update your CC info NOW, and in your hand it goes…
Rick and John Q. Coinage,
Rick mashed his peas with Ventris by calling her out on the L&B’s; that is what is known as a strategic error. But maybe this error has an Extra V!
Rick,
I would say you’re right on both counts. The first privy coin with the die will sell for over a hundred grand and the average collector has no chance to get one of the 230.
Kaiser, et al.,
I think you may be short-selling the value (?) of the #1 coin. I’d be surprised if it goes for less than $250K in the initial auction. In a year, when it goes to auction again, twice that. If the 1975 no-S clad dime in less-than-stellar condition can go for 1/2 mil, what do y’all expect of a coin set with a population of ONE?
Agreed, no “regular Joe” collectors need even apply for any of the 230 privies. Cali, below, may be underestimating those, too. I can only sit on the sidelines and watch!
I think you’re likely right.
Sam-I-am, A couple of thoughts regarding that. First, in the case of FHG Privy #1 it isn’t just the coin that’s likely going to be driving the value this time around since without the included die it is no different than the other 229 specimens, and that particular driver per se may or may not be as much of a factor in future re-sales. Secondly, when it comes to the sales potential of a super-expensive coin a good part of the monetary value it commands derives from the reality that ultra-wealthy buyers have bottomless pockets; therefore the auction price doesn’t… Read more »
And the value of 5he $ is off as far as buying stuff and investing so deflated value means $50 is the new $20.
“$50 is the new $20”
It sort of is. Not that long ago, places wouldn’t take a $50 bill. Now, they don’t even blink. Maybe they check the bill. Maybe they don’t. And ATMs spit them out like confetti.
Yup even the tellers at the banks agreed. $2 a new tip standard
Isn’t it amazing what printing trillions and trillions of dollars does to the value of your currency. I’ve told folks for years they are transforming the old dollar into a new peso.
Kaiser,
I have bottomless pockets also, well ai least one bottomless pocket, in a pair of jeans. It has a hole in it. Does that qualify me for the auction?
Craig,
It most certainly does, but likely not in the way you might be hoping. Which is to say, they almost always need someone to put all the chairs back. 😉
Disgusting money grab by the Mint. Another fail for the Mint Director.
You’re so right, Mike. Even David Ryder must be blushing at this one.
Rich and Mike,
Life is all about consequences, and I doubt Ms. Gibson will encounter any for this.
The consequences will be a nice pat on the back from the Mint Accountants, her other Boss..
As I’ve said before – “A Brilliant Mint Money Grab”, regardless of how one ‘feels’ about the situation at hand…
Let’s not forget the lucky Auction Firm cashing in on a minimum 20% Hammer House Fee!
Oh and 10% buyer fees… 2% “participation “ fee…. 1% Kamala retirement funding contributions
And lest we forget, the Mars Reusable Rocket Booster 5 cent deposit.
She’ll be just fine with a new book coming out, and a regular on The View. So loyal to her boss, very impressive!
CA is pink and purple in some spots! Not where I live. But the one consolation prize is that there are very few masculine men where I live, so the flirt ratio from women has increased on my end lol..
Rick,
If all “consequences” can be defined as rewards, one has learned nothing.
The consequences of my decision to work for myself is quite rewarding.
“To each his own” a wise man once said!
Good for you Rick. I did the same and as a ‘consequence’ of being in business I might vie for one of these 230 coins. I say ‘might’ because I’d like to have one, but don’t need one. I’m just curious as to what most are going to sell for and hope it’s in the realm of reality. We’ll know more by December 12th, at least I hope.
Congratulations back at you Craig!
There’s no going back for me if I have anything to say about it. I’ve gotten too used to working 6 months a year and still able to buy coins give or take…
The Realm of Reality will need to be sidelined for this FHG Privy…
Rich,
Just where is David Ryder now that we need him?
Actual pics 1
Nice that your photographer friend got a shot of one with the privy
I thought that was a shadow but you’re right. Don’t tell anyone else I got one with the privy
sharks2th and East Coast Guru,
When I was a kid a privy was the place you did your business outside the house.
Good one! 😀
Antonio,
Thank you, my friend. Who doesn’t appreciate being appreciated?
Kaiser,
You are appreciated. Your comments are always most welcome. When you were gone for a while, you were very much missed. Your insight is always rewarding.
Antonio,
Thank you very much. It’s not only exceedingly kind of you to say all of that but it would also be remiss of me if I neglected to attest to the fact that it definitely works both ways. Cheers!
Beautiful coin. Will be nice to look at at an ANA show or other large collectibles/coin show. That’s as close as anyone of us will get to such a beaut.
Pic 2
Beautiful,
Thanks Shark!
PS: I’m going to steal one of your lines AKBob…
“Drop Dead Gorgeous” !!
Rick, I couldn’t agree more with your description, “Drop Dead Gorgeous”!!! I can’t wait to see it in my hand! It’s looking like one of the most beautiful coins the Mint has produced in a very long time, i.e., 2009 UHR & 2006 Rev Proof, both gold coins. This one may be the nicest. A ton of “eye” appeal, which is what I really love about this one. I think most of us here are thinking the same! As far as the 230 Privy, those will be Extremely expensive! I’ll be looking at the Auction and “if” it looks like… Read more »
Been there, felt that. I agree with you – I think it’s a $50k baseline. I got the WWII privy for $8k. This coin is over 8x rarer. That puts a prospective bidder/buyer in the $64K-75K range.
Sharks2th,
I obviously have to ask. Why is the privy mark disguised in all these photos?
Pure speculation on my part,
Two out of the eight photos are the obverse and the privy is simply out of focus in those pics.
Also this looks to be photos taken in the secured/monitored area where a human-less device is encapsulating the raw coins..
Those FOMO Privy photos are leaked from the Mint intentionally…
Am I becoming a Mint shenanigan truther?
Shark?
You may be right Rick. I’m guessing when the video was done they were pressing the 230 with Ventris there, so the ones in the video were the ones with the privy.
Pic 3
Pic 4
Pic 5
You can see the privy in this pic too. Thanks for pointing it out ECG.
Pic 6
Pic 7
Looks like a small fin near the UN.
Or, could it be a damaged or incomplete rim edge?..
Interestingly, the edge lettering(*#7 above), particularly the star and the word “or” is casting a shadow onto the smooth rim. It’s a raised letter edge imo.
Awesome edge, right down to that collar seam. Sort of an “industrial” look going on!
Reminiscent of the 2009 UHR beauty…
I’ve got one of those in my collection. Compared to today’s price point it was a ‘steal’.
Pic 8
Great pictures. It looks great with a real photo. Anyway, This is what I posted on the prior thread…. This is ECG’s plan to buy a gold flowing hair coin in a few years on the secondary market. I will buy as much gold bullion as I can for the flowing hair projected price of $3,690 or so, the estimated price as of today. In a couple of years, Trade that gold for cash and use that money, probably plus just a little more to buy the flowing hair gold coin. The other Liberty gold coins 2015 (Angela Joelle) 2017,… Read more »
Thanks loooks awesome. I might have to try
Sharkie,
Crazy nice photography work braah.
Cheers
Why didn’t they also issue proof silver medals? 🙁
Antonio,
You must have noticed the Mint’s Suggestion Box opens into a trash bin.
I’ve been tempted to put one of those in my business for years.
The 2024 FH Silver Medals with Privy in OGP are going for $3,800-$4,000+. Depending on which TPG has holdered the medal, MS70’s are going for roughly $5,900-$7,000+. Not sure how the pricing will translate to the FHG, however with only 230 of the privy marked ones available at auction, I’d venture to say, none will sell for less than $20,000 and more than likely, will range from $30K+ to $50K+ possibly IMO. The 1st one with die and special packaging, should sell for over $100K no problem as Rick mentioned? I have a hard time believing or thinking that $50K+… Read more »
Cali an example of why it’s the hobby of king$. Auction who’s running it…… MezakAuctions….. somehow I smell a skunk, but I am in California
I say another cluster @ the Website the coin may get me back to try but we’ll c
John Q. Coinage,
Perhaps hard to come by six figure coins are more for self-made millionaires while the inherited wealth of kings restricts itself to seven figure ultimate rarities.
I smell it too, but then I realize it’s someone vaping pot.
Antonio,
That’s just Ventris celebrating her upcoming sure to be fabulous auction.
Cali – It’s that weird trick your mind plays when you stare at a pic. The shadows definitely show incused if you get the light at the right angle.
I’m thinking the same thing about the edge. The original dollars wouldn’t have had incused lettering. That didn’t happen until 1908.
This is going to be fun to see how it all plays out, but I can’t help feeling that the mint has no business getting into the auction arena. If this turns out being a rousing success (for the mint in monetary terms) then is this going to be an annual, bi-annual, or monthly event? Will any or all mint errors be pulled aside (or manufactured intentionally) destined for the new mints auction block. Time will tell but it certainly leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
I think the Royal Mint does rare coin auctions. It must be profitable
No doubt.
Craig,
Best be careful as to what ideas you’re putting into the Mint Director’s head.
The US mint has lost alot of customers with these higher prices on coins. So now they are going to have an auction on the rare coins to make up for the people not spending money on the over priced items. Just look at all the coins still available for sale compared to early years.
Mike Petraitis,
Unless the Mint is going after a much higher financial worth type of customer in which case freezing out the little people would likely be part of the overall plan.
Could be, I used to buy from them but no way nowadays. $1000 over spot for Au, it is a gamble on the FH w 17.5k coming. Or more shenanigans like the medal, only half sold WTF is going on. Not BO CU, indeed should be BO not CU w 1/2 the mintage sitting somewhere? Ventris’ closet gotta be getting full, the next auction
The FH Silver Medal still sits at 49,966 pcs on the updated 11/3 sales report. The 10/27 report says 49,996 pcs.
This seems very uncommon imo.
Where are the adjustments in faulty orders, cancelled, and returned Medals?
I’m not in the shenanigan Mint truther camp, but I could change my mind at any time.
https://www.usmint.gov/about/production-sales-figures/cumulative-sales
Rick, concur with your comments. There also seems to be a bit of confusion regarding the two most recent Coin News U.S. Mint Sales reports by Mike Unser posted on October 31 (sales for the week ending Oct. 27) and November 8 (sales for the week ending Nov. 3 [i.e., released sales figures by the Mint late on Nov. 7]). The October 31st Coin News sales report had latest sales = 49,970 (and old sales = 49,925). The November 8th Coin News sales report has latest sales = 49,996 (and old sales = 49,970). However, the most recent/current U.S. Mint… Read more »
Rick I’ve been at this since a pup in1968! Anyway, there have been sales beyond published #limits, resales of items SOut….mysterious web issues where som folk cleaned up, crazy unexplained 3am drops of Enhanced Rev ASEs for issue price when the were worth THOUSAND$- which release was a mistake but the mint allowed it to proceed who got them, who knew what and when-R¥der schenanagans….I’ve had orders cancelled, Oh and the loss and accidental “melt” of a pallet o gold coins….yeah time for a thick GSA audit back to 2017
Talk about a pup, yeah I was barely 4 and all I wanted was some Cracker Jack’s once in awhile and to go play outside, even in old Scottsdale lol.
I missed out on all of the Ryder shenanigans and paid dearly for the v75, but I do remember the spouse gold going missing.
I’m catching on, however giving the USM the benefit….
I’m a little slow you know!….
A $108 silver FH lotto ticket. Sure, no problem, what the heck. Well, it was a loser. A nice stocking stuffer though. I don’t think any of us on this site got a winning silver ticket. Now, a $3,700 gold FH lotto ticket. 230/17,500= (P) 0.01314 = 1.314% chance of a winner. As compared to the silver FH lotto ticket with a 2.39% chance of a winner. Is it worth the gamble? . I am curious to where and how the FHG auction will take place. Will it be an on-line auction conducted on the mint’s new and improved website… Read more »
E1,
I imagine they’ll use the same Auction House that they used for the Sunset/Sunrise of the last Type I and the first Type II. I don’t remember who was used, maybe Stacks Bowers!! I remember vaguely looking at the auction on those and I couldn’t believe the auction prices (very high)!! I didn’t place any bids on them, as I wasn’t interested in a “label”!!
Well, as always, Good Luck ALL!!!
Just curious, recall how remittance must be made? I presume by Wire, though did they take credit card? HELOC check (hehe)?
I was wondering the same thing. Plus, are there auction fees in addition to the purchase price?
REB, Good question.
Coin goes on Sale November 14th (Thursday).
If it’s like Great Collections there will be…, high single digit?
I think…. Or 10%… geez, makes my head hurt,
I wish they’d accept remittance in the form of my neighbor’s little b@$+@r& who keeps letting his dog poo in my yard….
I’ll gladly pay for expedited payment, poke some holes in that box, and off it goes…. Overnight delivery! 😉
AKBob,
For future use, I think it might be a good idea to learn how the “US Mint’s Official Auction Process” works firsthand. Maybe one of our “Coinnews.Net” columnists could produce an article about the details of the auction process for the FHG (e.g. when, where, how, who, fees, quantities, and starting $$$).
E1, I didn’t know the Mint had an official Auction Process. It would be nice to see it, officially. They used an Auction Company on the 2021 Type I and Type II ASE’s, the Sunset and Sunrise Auction. I’m going to go out on a limb and predict it’ll be the same for the FHG. If the “first” auction is 12/12, we “should” see/find out The Who, what, when, where, etc. prior to the 12th. Fees will be spelled out by the Auction Firm I suppose. They usually state that, if you looked at the auctions that Rick has posted… Read more »
According to the Mint’s news release email, the auction is supposed to take place December 12th. The release states – “Additional details about this special auction will be released at a later date.”
This article states the auction will take place on December 12th. Any further information will come from the mint. I’d like to acquire one if the hysterical nature of folks can be controlled, but if people bid on these like it’s their only chance at getting rich, then I’ll let someone else have ‘the shiny new object.’ I’m convinced this will just be the beginning of the mint providing ‘coin rarities’ to a gullible public. I am a bit disappointed because no one seems to be concerned about how this will affect Magic Mike. He is after all our country’s… Read more »
FHG Pricing (based off of previous weekly London Fix average, Thurs thru Weds) –
AM / PM Fix
11/7 – $2,667.05 / $2,692.0
11/8 – $2,685.20 / $2,691.15
11/11 – /
11/12 – /
11/13 – /
11/14 – Game Day
Running average = $2,683.85
Grid range (Avg to-date): $2,650 – $2,699.99
Forecasted Price: $3,690*
*based off of weekly running average
Gentlemen, (& any ladies lurking out there).., Regarding the concern about how early you need to be camped out on the Waiting Room starting line to pull the trigger on FHG – CW confirmed that production of the entire authorized mintage was achieved.., so all 17,500 will be available, Thinking you’ll have ample time to place your order, JMTC FWIW, So AKBob.., no need to break out in a heavy sweat and racing pulse to beat the clock.., have a Shasta, pace yourself, and enjoy the journey of navigating the new and improved mint website experience.. LOL, Plus, there’s the… Read more »
Oops.., 17,270 available.., AKBob has the market on ‘the other 230’ cornered…. 😉
You’re cracking me up, KC&SO!
Aren’t the big buys suppose to get their 10% cut in advanced sales
Actually VinnieC, thinking there was a discussion on a previous thread that ascertained that the AP’s can order UP TO 10%.., AND THEN, there’s a Numismatic program that allows Dealers/AP’s to buy more under that program for a premium…
2024 Flowing Hair Silver Medal – 41,044
Flowing Hair Silver Medal (Bulk) – 8,926
Posted the above for reference, the aforementioned might explain how the BULK AP sales captured 17.86% of FHS struck inventory….
Guys, that’s 18%….
Messed up in my opinion, when the FHS went CU 90 seconds of the HHL being lifted on 16 Oct.., and remains CU approaching 4 weeks later… (though we do know that the USM is awaiting the returns, before striking any more…)
Recant my last…. My apologies Gentlemen.., my math was waaayyyyyyyy oooffffffff…. AKBob has the 230 cornered… The AP’s under the AP & Numismatic program has 10,000 of these FHGs spoken for… That leaves 7,270 left for us non label collecting minions to dib on.., so we all better be in the waiting room by 11:30 EST…. Sweating and heart racing profusely…, “add to bag” trigger finger warmed up, and ready for Go! just kidding, at 17.500.. everyone gets a medal, oh, a coin, this time, No wait.., Ventris and mint team get’s their cut.., and then all of the Congressional… Read more »
KCSO, Dang, you’re killing me! My hearts going to be a pounding when I “attempt” to get one. I’m feeling confident but if there’s enough folks out there that want this, it could sell out in a few minutes. I hope it sells out in a few minutes. Gives more chances for “Legs”, at least temporarily. I have three already pre ordered so I’m hoping I’ll end up with at least one. I’ve had Sellers cancel me before because they realized if they canceled they could resell again for more money! If it sells out in minutes, you’ll see prices… Read more »
This is their best solution to overcome the decades of massive annual losses incurred with cent and nickel production. With 230 going up for auction they should at least break even.
I like the coin. I would like to buy one. But the mintage limit puts me off as I only seeing it appreciating on the spot value of gold. Sort of like buying a proof AGE. Although this is a completely different coin, but 17,500 is a lot for the market absorb. Not sure it makes financial sense. Still kicking the idea around.
Yeah, I’m right there with ya Sir…. Any thoughts on when the ‘CU’ flag will post? Best guesstimate…?
Thinking the 230 changes the dynamics on this one considerably.., & the ‘run of the mill’ will be around for a bit…
“Thinking the 230 changes the dynamics on this one considerably.., & the ‘run of the mill’ will be around for a bit…”
I’m inclined to agree.
Since the 230 is not part of us plebes being able to buy as a random mint bonus, my guess is this coin will be around for awhile. I could be wrong, and in one sense, I hope I am, but unless the general public gets excited about this coin, us the coin collectors will be the only buyers. Not many of us out there who can afford to pay the piper. 17.5 is only the limit. CU may go up early like the medal as a way to instill a FOMO. Mint decides to only make 8,000 since they… Read more »
Well, I looked on line to a big dealer and a regular no Privy flowing hair gold pr-70 is selling for $5,500. What do they know that we don’t. They were selling the silver medal for the same price as a presale but that had a privy.
ECG, KCSO pointed out the Coin World Nov. 8 article which cited: Production of the limited-edition Proof 2024 230th Anniversary Flowing Hair, High Relief 1-ounce .9999 fine gold dollar is completed, with the maximum mintage of 17,500 coins executed at the West Point Mint in New York. U.S. Mint spokesman Michael White confirmed to Coin World via email Oct. 30 that production of the entire authorized mintage was achieved.
I couldn’t agree more ECG! This coin will have 17,500 pressed and at close to $4000 I just don’t see it vanishing as quickly as some think. It is a nice looking coin, but it still only has an ounce of Au, right? And let’s not forget that any buyer can only order 1 coin.
Isn’t it something that a $3,700 coin is perceived to “run of the mill” – kinda off-putting that the one you’d really like to have will range from $50,000 to $200,000 plus….
Spot on, KC&SO.
Like I said before, my collection likely will become publicly available gold proof coins. I don’t consider an auction to be publicly available. It’s more like a VIP token.
Spot on back at you too REB & Stacker. Particularly in the pricing speculation on the privy’s, possibly an even higher bar may be set? Sam-I-Am is also on target for the $250k privy/die pairing imo. There is nothing artificial about the scarcity of the Gold privy coin, not in the least. The demand vs supply is going to dictate the very high cost of these coins. And later on as Sam said, prices will likely go up due to tight hands and dark vaults, enhancing scarcity further.. I will argue this REB.. I believe the auction will be completely… Read more »
Interesting stuff. Thanks for the info, Rick. Do you think the auction firm will provide a grade for each coin or is the remote buyer responsible for their own grading (in other words, “buyer beware”)? Are photos of each coin taken from a variety of angles? Are the images reviewable days before the auction? Might a consensus develop on which coins are the best? Are bids blind or can you see what’s happening in a particular auction in real time? Are all auctions simultaneous or sequential? So many questions and so much speculation ….
True, lots of speculation from myself as well. It would be better imo if they were all professionally graded, then one would have more confidence in what they may receive. Even then there are noticeable differences from one 70 to the next. There are no perfect coins. I would say that the coins must be viewable in high resolution photos, presented online for several days before the final Hammer hits, and in sequential order in real time, say 5 to 10 minutes between each one? I would not participate in a blind auction. Again, all pure speculation on my part.… Read more »
Rick, I too would like to see these graded! I’m going to take a uneducated guess and say they will be graded, mainly I believe this because the 2021 Dawn to Dusk Silver Eagle auction, Stack Bowers did, were ALL graded “if” I remember correctly! How would you feel if you paid $500K for the very first one and it only graded out a PF69 and the second one auctioned was a 70 for $275K!! Let’s take this one more step, what if the first one does grade out a 69, will the mint substitute the next one produced that… Read more »
Maybe it will end up like the Liberty and Britannia gold coin. I still haven’t opened mine yet because im thinking about getting it graded at the PCGS member show in Las Vegas Nevada around December 10th-13th I think. I don’t like mailing mine in. But that had a mintage of 10,000 but only 5,500 were sold. So just because they are minting 17,500 doesn’t mean they will sell out. But i like buying on the 1st day.As for special privy I probably wouldn’t pay more than $10,000 for one. Also I have been collecting since 2009 and I have… Read more »
How are they guaranteed one with a privy mark just like they got the silver medal with privy mark. I guess the individual should get them also!! Right
Auction new flowing hair gold coin with 230 privy!! What about the little person? Auction will price us out what a fing joke!!
Bruce,
We’ve ALL been saying that basically! Us “regular” folks won’t have a snow balls chance in hell to acquire one of the Privy 230’s!! We will be priced out! I’ll be watching but I’ve got limits like everyone else. The sky is the limit on those 230 specimens! Lordy, Lordy, I would love, love to be WRONG!!! Less than a week to go for FHG Day!! Make sure you take your doggie downers so you don’t have a heart attack trying to order one of these! I will be, lol! 🙂
AKBob, on Flowing Hair Gold Day at launch time, I’ll be singing Hair…
Hair, hair, hair, hair, hair, hair, hair
Flow it, show it
I’m guessing everyone here is like me and also doesn’t have a snowballs chance in hell of ever being able to afford a newly built beachfront house in the Hamptons either so why is everyone whining about a stupid coin that only the wealthy can afford? It sounds like most of you did vote for Elon after all. Maybe he will just buy them all and hand them out to us worthy people.
CAG was right! More and More Gimmicks, Higher and Higher Prices, Lower and Lower Mintages!! Get ready for 2025! I’m sure everyone has seen or heard about the Silver Eagle (bullion) w/Star Privy. Next year, there’s going to be another ASE with a Privy, it’s going to be a Flag Privy!!
You heard right here on CN first!! I got it from a very reliable source! 😉 Get ready, Ventris is up to more Gimmicks!
Well, as always, Good Luck ALL!!!
I keep thinking what pre 33 coin can I get for $3,700 that would be just as gorgeous to look at. Hmmm..
ECG, I’m in your court after this release. I’ll be done with Mint Numismatic gold too. However, in answer to your about questions, I can’t think of ANY pre ‘33 that you could purchase that could hold a candle to this FHG, JMHO tho. If there is one, let me/us know as I’d be very curious plus interested in what kind it would be. Good luck getting any Gold CC’s other than AU at best more than likely, or maybe a “C” Charlotte or “D” mint marked, NOT Denver, but Dahloneg Mint but the condition most likely wouldn’t be a… Read more »
Tell me more about this ASE w/flag privy. Anymore details? Maybe I should save my money for that?
ECG, All I know is I heard that there’s going to be another bullion ASE w/flag privy in 2025, exactly when I do not know that ……yet!! It’ll be similar to the one now that has a Star Privy, mintage limit of 500K. I don’t know the mintage or the story that’ll be behind this release either……..yet!! The 2024 (P) is the lowest minted bullion Silver Eagle ever! I purchased some at the very beginning of the Sales of the Star Privy, First 50K, for $99. Those are now selling for $400+!! I also was able to purchase a roll… Read more »
AKBob,
Good God, gee willikers and holy cow, Batman! Yet a couple more big money makers from the US Mint, one already out and the other one to arrive next year. I honestly can’t remember there ever previously being so many different coins with this kind of serious actual and potential profit coming from the Mint in such numbers and so close together at that. Hallelujah, I guess.
I’m sure they will press over 100,000 of them. I recently saw Magic Mike was selling the 2024 with star privy for just $99.
Get ’em while they’re hot, or buyer’s remorse.
I just ran across this for the first time while looking to see if a PR was released for the Type 1 / Type 2 auction held a few years ago – worth a quick read, and seems in considerable contrast to the FHG Privy release (aka, money grab auction restricted for the financial elite),
I appreciate Mr. Ryder releasing the following for transparency, in keeping with his professional character, in my opinion –
A Message from United States Mint Director David J. RyderNovember 18, 2020
Well I can’t get the link to post, anyone know how to post a web link?
It’s under Press Releases, Nov 18, 2020
A shout out to all the Veteran’s here on CN –
Appreciate your service as you’ve helped make this world a better and more secure place with your courage, sacrificed, and dedication to our country.., & may we never forget our brothers-in-arms we lost along the way…
Cheers Mates!
Oh, and of course, Go Navy, Beat Army!
Here it is –
First Type 2, Last Type 1 American Eagles Set Records at Stack’s Bowers Auction
By CoinWeek, September 2, 2022
On September 1, 2022, Stack’s Bower Galleries held an unusual auction comprised of 700 lots, all 2021 American Gold Eagle and 2021 American Silver Eagle bullion coins. Off the bat, auction prices were strong. Stack’s Bowers offered individual pieces from the sets as individual lots. Starting with the 20th-to-last Type 1 Silver Eagle struck and continuing to the very last pieces, collectors bid spiritedly at levels in excess of $1,500 USD per coin. With gold eagles, enthusiasm was also high–most sold for $4,000 or more. As the coins hit the single digits of first and last struck, the prices begin to climb. The seventh new Gold… Read more »
The very last Type 1 American Gold Eagle one-ounce bullion coin ever struck sold for a record $77,500. The very first Type 2 AGE ever struck sold for a breathtaking record price of $100,000. The perennial favorite Type 1 American Silver Eagle one-ounce bullion coin set new records as well. The last Type 1 ASE ever struck sold for $85,000–just shy of the $86,654 that a PR70DCAM 1995_W Silver Eagle brought in a 2013 Great Collections auction. That, however, was a Proof strike; $85,000 sets the record for the highest price realized for an Uncirculated strike. The first Type 2 Silver Eagle… Read more »
Yea, Sam-I-am called this one….
FHG Privy w/ COA #1 & die…. $250,000+
I have a 1995-W Silver Eagle but it’s graded at PF68. I was considering having it regraded by NCG as they’re known to upgrade a little.
Here’s the USM PR – I would suspect the FHG will be rolled out the same.., with the usual suspects –
2021 American Eagle at Dusk and at Dawn 35th Anniversary Gold and Silver One-Ounce Coins To Be Sold at Auction September 1
August 10, 2022
WASHINGTON – The United States Mint (Mint) is pleased to announce the public auction on September 1 of special limited editions of 2021 American Eagle at Dusk and at Dawn 35th Anniversary One-Ounce American Eagle Bullion Coins. These limited-edition coins marking transition between old and new designs were produced during a special April 2021 ceremony. The event featured the striking of the last of the American Gold Eagle and American Silver Eagles bearing their original designs and the production of first of those coins featuring the new design. “By offering these unique coin sets for auction, we are reaching out to the… Read more »
Stack’s Bowers Galleries will conduct the auction at its headquarters in Costa Mesa, CA, at 1550 Scenic Ave. #150, on September 1, and auction attendees will have the option of participating in-person and virtually, at.., Prior to auction, samples of the coins will be on display at the American Numismatic Association’s 2022 Chicago World’s Fair of Money® from August 16-20, 2022 in the Donald E. Stephens Convention Center, Hall F, 5555 N River Rd, Rosemont (Chicago), IL 60018, at United States Mint booth 1925 and at Stack’s Bowers booth 1006. The newly designed gold coins have been paired with those… Read more »
Bet dollars to donuts, some the FHG 230 Privies will be on display in Baltimore, at Whitman, on the 14th
Keep Calm & Stack On,
It’s amazing how much financial impact the “minting order” can have!
Flowing Hair Gold Privy Coin Guesstimate Game –
might as well have fun with something we ain’t gonna get..,
Winner gets a free Virtual FHG Privy Coin! Place your wager!
COA #1 – $315,000
Lowest Bid – $33,000
Is that the lowest WINNING bid on any of the 230 coins?
Thanks REB, and made me rethink that lowest,
Flowing Hair Gold Privy Coin Guesstimate Game –
might as well have fun with something we ain’t gonna get..,
Winner gets a free Virtual FHG Privy Coin! Place your wager!
COA #1 Winning Bid – $315,000
Lowest Winning Bid of the 230 – $47,000
If someone is closest to both winning bids, they win TWO virtual FHGs!
Nothing like laughing through the tears!
I’ll play the game:
COA #1 – $500,000
Lowest winning bid – $35,000
You can send my prize/s to this board.
“…laughing though the tears!”
Funny, and true.., ain’t no box of chocolates in this boys future, I’ll be sticking with Costco for my future PMs buys.., after this release
Keep Calm & Stack On,
But as Forrest Gump said, “You never know what you’re going to get.”
KCSO,
COA #1 Winning Bid – $500K
Lowest Winning Bid 230 – $77K
Well, as always, Good Luck ALL!!!
Keep Calm & Stack On,
I’m not going to participate unless I receive assurances that the two virtual FHGs I would get for winning the guesstimation game each have a virtual privy mark.
They’ll be two, a privy on the Observe, and Reverse, just for you…
Kaiser & KC&SO,
You guys are killing it here. I see a bright future for both of you on the Catskills comedy circuit.
REB,
Now that you mention it, I can see how it unfolds: Keep Kalm & The Kaiser, Kool Kats of the Catskills. We’ll be here all week.
lol
Keep Calm & Stack On,
Well now, If it’s really that easy to get such generous virtual concessions here, I would also like to add a virtual error reverse virtual privy mark on the virtual edge of each virtual coin.
Attention Gold Owners:
The current sizeable decline in gold values is quite certainly a temporary phenomenon. Please try to refrain from having your ninteteenth nervous breakdown.
Time to buy?
The Price is Right Flowing Hair Gold Privy Winning Bid Guesstimate Game –
might as well have fun with something we ain’t gonna win..,
Winner gets a free Virtual FHG Privy Coin! Place your wager!
COA #1 Winning Bid / Lowest Winning Bid
REB – $500k / $35k
AKBob – $500k / $77k
KCSO – $315k / $47k
$410,000 winning bid. $25,000 lowest bid. Can I pick up my virtual prize in person?
lol.
East Coast Guru,
I’m considerably surprised that someone with your typically outstanding numismatic acumen just happens to not be cognizant of the fact that virtual prizes can only be collected by way of virtual holographic projection. Tsk tsk.
Sure! As long as you show up 36-24-26, Blonde & blue eyes, and somewhere there’s a label with a ‘D’ on it….
COA #1 – $665,000 winning bid.
Privy – $27,000 lowest winning bid.
Keep Calm & Stack On,
Please be careful not to get anyone’s virtual hopes up only to virtually disappoint them.
Ag and Au spot prices are cratering today! Will this lead to lower minimum bids on those 230 privy FH’s?
I doubt it will lower the bids on the 230 privy, but hopefully it will lower the price the mint is asking for the regular ones.
Craig,
I seriously doubt that will be the case. Consider that an ounce of gold at the current rate of $2629 represents only 5.26% of the estimated $50,000 auction price of a privy mark Flowing Hair Gold Coin. That means the precious metal content of the coin amounts to a far too insignificant percentage of the total projected sales value of this gold coin to even be taken into account when establishing the auction price.
FHG Pricing (based off of previous weekly London Fix average, Thurs thru Weds) –
AM / PM Fix
11/7 – $2,667.05 / $2,692.0
11/8 – $2,685.20 / $2,691.15
11/11 – $2,670.55 / $2,624.75
11/12 – /
11/13 – /
11/14 – Game Day
Running average = $2,671.78
Grid range (Avg to-date): $2,650 – $2,699.99
Forecasted Price: $3,690*
*based off of weekly running average
Let’s Make a Deal Flowing Hair Gold Privy Winning Bid Guesstimate Game –
might as well have fun with something we ain’t gonna win..,
Winner gets a free Virtual FHG Privy Coin! Place your wager!
COA #1 Winning Bid / Lowest Winning Bid
Antonio – $665k / $27k
REB – $500k / $35k
AKBob – $500k / $77k
ECG – $410k / $25k
KCSO – $315k / $47k
Keep Calm & Stack On,
COA #1 Winning Bid – $155K
Lowest Winning Bid – $22K
The most bearish prediction yet. I hope you’re right, Kaiser.
FHS – 49,966 > 49,913 – 53 (11/10/2024)
If you believe that.., I don’t, suspect we’re just seeing the credit card cancellations from the week of 15 October that couldn’t be reconciled….
Here she is… fore head and all.., a glorious gorgeous gal in all,
Image Library is live..,
This product is included in the Mint’s Authorized Bulk Purchase Program (ABPP). Products listed in the ABPP will be eligible for early release, carry an AB suffix in the product code, and carry a premium. Early released products are not eligible for discounts.
I hope to possess her someday soon. I understand she’s a high-maintenance lass with a head-strong sense of independence and an insatiable desire to be only with those who can support her extravagant lifestyle.
God help me for coveting her so.
Wave Off!
Wave Off!
That there is a blue print to a couple of my past expensive mistakes….
The Trophy you seek is Not Worth the head ache…. Run away.., Run away…
lol.
“The Price is WRONG, Beotch” Flowing Hair Gold Privy Winning Bid Guesstimate Game –
might as well have fun with something we ain’t gonna win..,
Winner gets a free Virtual FHG Privy Coin & bragging rights for all their years of experience…
COA #1 Winning Bid / Lowest Winning Bid
Antonio – $665k / $27k
REB – $500k / $35k
AKBob – $500k / $77k
ECG – $410k / $25k
KCSO – $315k / $47k
The Kaiser – $155k / $22k
COA #1 Average: $424k
Lowest Winning Avg: $39k
Total speculation on my part.., though 10-12x between the lowest to the highest might actually be reasonably in the ball park….
I’m leaning towards Antonio’s high-side bid, thinking I am way low now…,
I think I can work with the Lowest Winning Avg number IF it’s anywhere near the final amount. Start creeping towards AKBob’s prediction and I’m out.
REB,
I’m beginning to think the world has lost its mind. There are Ag FH medals, with the privy mark, on eBay with asking prices of $4k, $5k, and over $20k with an autograph! If people are spending that for a medal, I’m wondering if any of these will sell for less than $100k.
No.
The demand will be too great given the scant supply. Pure speculation, but I’d venture to say that less than 200 will be auctioned off. The rest are already in the hands of Mint insiders and elite buddies.
The Au Privy auction will include collectors not only from the US, but abroad as well. The well-to-do in Asia, India, and the Emirates love their Money and Gold, just to name a few…
Not that they’re all collectors, but in Palm Beach County, FL alone, there are 10,000 Millionaires, and 60 Billionaires that live there. Something to consider when the entertaining auction takes place!…
FHG Pricing (based off of previous weekly London Fix average, Thurs thru Weds) –
AM / PM Fix
11/7 – $2,667.05 / $2,692.0
11/8 – $2,685.20 / $2,691.15
11/11 – $2,670.55 / $2,624.75
11/12 – $2,590.75 / $2,606.85
11/13 – /
11/14 – Game Day
Running average = $2,653.53
Grid range (Avg to-date): $2,650 – $2,699.99
Forecasted Price: $3,690* …momentum leaning towards $3,640
*based off of weekly running average
Well, well.., didn’t think tomorrow would matter, Tomorrow matters,
Keep Calm & Stack On,
I do, however, recall one particular refrain from the musical Jesus Christ Superstar in which the advice given is “Don’t you think about tomorrow, think about today instead!”
This is new –
Item Number: 24YH
Mintage Limit: 75,000
Product Limit: 50,000
Household Order Limit: None
Something is lurking behind the scenes…
Recall Rich or Rick commenting about the prospects of a two coin set..,
That prospect just went up in the betting markets…. 😉
NO WAY on God’s Green Beautiful Earth that the USM is going to let sit idle the potential of 25,000 FHS in the execution of ‘Operation Money Grab!’
Hold on Boys & Girls.., it’s about to get more interesting…
FHS –
Maybe due to some backlash from the Privy.., perhaps they’ll strike more Privies, just without the signed COA’s.. which would be just fine.
OR.., auction off a bunch more Privies at the auction house,
FHG Pricing (based off of previous weekly London Fix average, Thurs thru Weds) – AM / PM Fix 11/7 – $2,667.05 / $2,692.0 11/8 – $2,685.20 / $2,691.15 11/11 – $2,670.55 / $2,624.75 11/12 – $2,590.75 / $2,606.85 11/13 – estimated $2,616 / $2,606 11/14 – Show Time Running average = $2,645.04 Grid range (Avg to-date): $2,600 – $2,649.99 Forecasted Price: $3,640* *based off of weekly running average Calling it early.., looks like buyers of the FHG just squeaked by (by my calculations) of $5 in the weekly London Fix average to get just under the $2,650 pricing range grid.., AND… Read more »
Great job projecting the price of the FHG at $3,640 for tomorrow’s release, KCSO, as verified on the Mint product page a few hours ago. Dropping two grid price ranges for a $100 price reduction is no small feat and is encouraging for all prospective buyers.
Every bit helps! FHG could have easily been $3,890 had we still been counting votes this week..,
Good luck today! Think you mentioned the possibility of a 2-coin set, yeah hoping we’ll see another surprise from the mint’s bag of tricks.., once these medals and gold coins are struck, they can roll them out as they wish, as you know.
Otherwise guess we’re waiting till 2026 for the 1804 Bustie Babe! Cheers!
Someone will pay $100.000 and in a year they will bring it to the pawn stars in Vegas they will tell Rick they want $100.000 for it and he will offer them $1.000 for it LOL.
I guess I am a 20 Liberty and St Gaudens type collector but I find the Flowing Hair Gold underwhelming. The silver Flowing Hair is more impressive.
Coin #1 (supposedly) approaching 100k. How high will she eventually fly.